Need for freedom and control-freakiness?

[Sunshine]

Originally Posted by Jae Rae

I don't see the wish to be thanked for a kindness as control-freakiness.

Letting the pizza burn because someone says "your timer just went off" (ie, it's time to take the pizza out) doesn't make sense to me, but I've known people to do this.

I dunno that Jeffster saw it as control freakiness either. Jeffster?
I think he was just giving an example of how he just can't do what someone "forces" on him. Jeffster?

[alicia91]

Isn't it the obvious behavior modification that bothered you Jeffster? Kind of like training a dog. I don't like that either, but with kids - sometimes it's the only way to go.

[Jeffster]

Originally Posted by Sunshine

Jeffster
Jeffster?
Jeffster?

Eh wha? You summoned me like Beetlejuice?

[entropie]

Originally Posted by alicia91

I have been talking to my husband (ENTJ) about freedom, conformity, arbitrary rules, being a control freak etc. He might not like conforming to someone else, following rules and so forth, but he generally has no problem with it, and if he sees the logic then he might actually support it. I have a real issue with some of these things and I often remind him of my need to manouver, set my own pace, etc. and he believes that this is all a crock and that it's basically just me being a control-freak. He says I grew up stubborn and spoiled because my parents let me do as I pleased, now that I'm older I refuse to cooperate with other's agendas (unless I am in agreement) because of this.

I admit that I've not given this any indepth thought, but just curious what your thoughts are. I guess what I'm asking is - is the need for freedom really about control for many of you?

BTW- I don't think that I'm a control-freak at all, that's just his interpretation. But typed me as an ISTJ (but admits I'm more creative)!

I think control is, to get lost once in a while, to find oneself again and that goes for p and J's.

What I find difficult with my girlfriend, for example, is that she always needs an explanation of why I am doing things.

I have not found a solution to that misery yet.

I just can say, sometimes she prevents me from doing bad things and sometimes she hinders me in my way.

[FDG]

What's the problem if you are spoiled, but this being "spolied" allows you not to be tied to other's expectations and plans? In my opinion (and as the same type as him), your husband might actually be slightly envious of your ability to disagree with other's plans. However I don't understand very well how this is tied to being a "control freak"? That would be true only as long as you actually wanted others to conform to your plans (in which case, I'd agree with him).

At first glance, I recognized this as unhealthy ENTJ style projection, where in fact it's they who are stubborn control freaks with relentless agendas, but they make out it's you. One of my ENTJ's went through a phase like that... took a lot of working through but he's great now.

We also have to check where this sentence was placed; basically I sometimes discuss those types of things "freely" just as a form of ideas exchange, without really believing strongly in a point/thinking I am right.

[alicia91]

What I find difficult with my girlfriend, for example, is that she always needs an explanation of why I am doing things.

I have that tendency also. I'm not sure why, I guess it's the Ti wanting to make sense of things.

However I don't understand very well how this is tied to being a "control freak"? That would be true only as long as you actually wanted others to conform to your plans (in which case, I'd agree with him).

I guess it depends on your definition of control/control-freak. In his mind, it means several things including 1) controling others 2) not cooperating/hindering the plan which he feels is a form of passive control-freakiness (you are trying to control another's agenda by not cooperating)

[wolfy]

Yeah, not wanting to be controlled. It feels so right to push back but I must admit it developed into a reaction over time, I try to move back and look at the others objective before blocking now (or I try at least)

You have to be careful though there are a lot of Nurse Ratched out there giving out "advice"

[millerm277]

Yes. The need for freedom is attached to the desire to not be controlled by others.

[Maverick]

Originally Posted by substitute

Unless Maverick was born perfect, he probably went through phases like this himself at some point in his life. Maybe he could tell you from an insider's view, how an ENTJ can get to thinking around that sorta behaviour... he's pretty balanced now (or at least seems to be lol). In all probability he won't look at this thread though, so give himm a shout. He usually helps out

I wasn't born perfect, but it was damn close...

Anyway I'm hear and I saw your message, you cheeky buggar! Ok, ok, I'll answer!

The way I see it is that there is absolutely no point to control other people because they will never internalize the principles you are trying to pass onto them. They need to have freedom of choice and do things because they believe it is the right thing and because it makes them feel better. People need to understand things and want to do them, not be pressured to do them in any way. On the other hand, I believe that controlling policies and rules is fundamental to ensuring an efficient and fair outcome for all people in a system.

["?"]

Originally Posted by Maverick

On the other hand, I believe that controlling policies and rules is fundamental to ensuring an efficient and fair outcome for all people in a system.

Could not agree more with this statement, but this does not equate to being control freaks which is what I consider someone who micromanages. I simply despise micromanagers because it says more about their own insecurities than what is occurring in a system. On the other hand back to your, the need for consistency in applying rules and regulations is paramount.