ENTPs and Developing One-Pointedness

[Samuel De Mazarin]

To all ENTPs (and others with a similar problem),

How do you attain focus? Or, as it was put in a famous scripture, one-pointedness?

I was told in high school by a teacher that I was constantly juggling so many interests that I was bound to drop them all and be left with nothing... I've found he was dead on.

Back in the day, I'd decide I liked a sport, practice for six months, and join the varsity team in school, then quit forever after the season and never look back... I'd like a certain author or philosophy, and would learn enough about it to enthuse even experts (many professors have tried to 'take me under their wing') and then I'd forget about it for the next new idea... I'd audition for an improv group in the village, make it, and drop out... I'd join a firm and take up a job in finance, just get to the point where I was earning some good money, and drop out... etc. etc.

So I rarely get myself to stick to one thing...

From what I've read, the best single practice seems to be building up focus through meditative techniques... Frost had his forest walks, Yehudi Menhuin had yoga and, of course, his violin... and so on...

But what works for you all? How have you managed to stick your noses to the grindstone and commit to one specific task at hand and see it through to the end? How do you get to the end of a sentence without using ellipses...? (yeah yeah, it's about the journey)

As I wrote above, this is not necessarily just for ENTPs... a lot of people of all types have difficulty figuring out what's right for them... but even when I know that I love something, it's difficult for me to focus focus focus... go through what I like calling the "donkey work" that's indispensable to achieving something in anything...

[Oberon]

I am highly interested to see what, if any, effective answers you receive.

[Shadowrose]

I wish I could help, here, but my single largest failing is that I can't finish projects. The closest I've ever come, I managed to get it into a state of being reasonably complete.. I did that by essentially chopping off the last quarter of what I had to do. Luckily, I had planned it out in such a way that it'd be acceptable without the rest of the work done.. if that makes sense. If you plan the abstract finish line farther than the concrete one, it's easier to cross the concrete one before you decide the abstract one isn't worth your while any longer.

Aside from that.. I really wish I knew. It's frustrating how often projects just get set aside, inadvertently, because of something new.

[spirilis]

Heh, on a side note, as an INTP I sound like that too--juggling lots of things at once, the difference is my "projects" end up happening on a more geologic timescale because I have neither the energy nor the motivation to hurry on anything after its immediate allure or usefulness has left me. But I don't necessarily scrap it either.

The pure, raw "focus" you seek only happens to me when a task or project bears a very, very REAL sense of urgency. Meaning, serious consequences if it's not done. The moment I find out the so-called "urgency" is contrived from someone pushing my buttons my mental focus starts to cloud with static.

[The_Liquid_Laser]

As an ENTP the way to finish what you've started is basically to let thinking come in and slap intuition around whenever it wants to start a new project or just give up.:angry:

What I've found works for me is to start with something small. Like my mind gets me really excited about something, and it immediately imagines some huge scale thing. Well take that and break it off into one part or just downscale it a lot. Or maybe choose some activity with a definite time commitment (3 months or 6 months or something). The idea is to have the end clearly defined from the beginning, and to be fairly easy achieve. Limit yourself to just one project or activity. Don't commit yourself to anything else until that one thing is done.

Now here is the hardest part:
Stick with it until the end and don't give up.

"Hey wait something really cool just came up, and I want to do that too." No! *smack* Don't do that. Don't give up your goal. Even if you aren't interested in it anymore don't give up. Even when it gets painful don't give up. Let me tell you it will get painful. Don't...give...up!

This is why it's important to focus on only one project at a time. It would be too stressful to try to do this for more than one thing. You've got to focus on that one thing and don't give up.

That is also why thinking is important. Your intuition is impulsive. Thinking will remind you of the reward at the end of the project. It may not feel fun anymore, but thinking can tell you that you'll actually get something by seeing it through til the end. Thinking is ultimately what lets you finish projects.

[ThatGirl]

I have found that the best way to do this to forget thinking in terms of a means to an end. In fact forget the end completely. Nothing is ever finished because with each step the information changes and new possibilities present themselves in which one thing can lead to another. However if you stop something before it is finished you gained nothing and the possibilities for growth are limited.

After years of feeling like I kept repeating life with no growth, except maybe a reasonable knowledge, to show for it I began to focus on the levels of actualization. By keeping the bigger picture in mind it has helped me to realize that all the things I must complete now are not indefinite but necessary. Without an immediate end in sight my goals have become larger and my interest necessary for the bigger picture.

I get shit done.

[ThatGirl]

On sencond thought you get to a point where you know how stuff works and you start to focus on where this goes.

[entropie]

Very interesting topic and I will have to think about it before I will give you a good answer.

I quitely have developed in that field and do not have the same issues with dropping things, like I had some years before. Today I mainly try to stay focussed by destroying my world. If there is an important thing to be brought to an end, I firstly measure, how good I am at it, in comparing me to others. On this part I was not really good, cause I have always thought of me being just not good enough. Some day that changend and I lost track of the others. Pretty entered some world of my own. Today there are only few times, I get to compare with others and mostly it is by accident or because it is not avoidable. To say the least, I have grown independent from people's opinions. That firstly sounds bad, but it helped me in getting down with my goals.

The second thing I do, when faced with too much input, I go crazy about it. I cut everyone unnecessary off and pull off everyone that wants to get near me, to start lamenting about my lone existence. When then I reach the point, I get bored of lamenting, I start focussing on the things I do under the tragic premisse, what other things are left ?

That only happend once though.

About the rest I have to think

[Ilah]

I am INTJ and I have problems with this too.

Two issues are trying to do to many different things at one time (starting new projects before old ones are due) and not sticking with things very long.

Sometimes I will try to do several different hobbies at one time, with the result that some of them I do so infrequently, I don't build up much skill at them.

Generally something will keep my interest for about a year, possibly as long as two years, maybe as little as 6 month. I have a habbit of building up a fair amount of art or craft supplies before my interest turns to something else.

I have started making committments to myself - I will study this area for at least 2 years, I will stick with learning to improve my drawing and art for at least 4 years. I actually broke it down a little bit with my art, made a list of specific things I would do with 1 to 3 months listed for specific things. Art is such a broad area. I have been doing it for around a year, but I have been pretty unfocused experimenting with different subject matter, media and artistic styles. I have tried to make it more focused by picking one thing to work on for a year and one thing to work on for three years.

One thing I have done is to tell myself that I can still do everything I want to do. I have a couple little note books and when I see new things that interest me, I write it down and tell myself it is on the list of things to do or study. Even though it may be years before I get to it, telling myself later, rather than no, makes it easier. I don't know if I will get to everything on my list. I started it this month and there is already about 10 to 20 years worth of stuff on it.

I also allow myself small exceptions to the keeping focused. For example, I choose personality types as the 2 year focus for my study. So all the non-fiction books I read in the next 2 years will be on this subject. However, I still read internet articles on various subjects that catch my interest. If it looks intreging I will put it on my list of things to study more in depth.

Ilah

[entropie]

Since when you are iNTj @Ilah ?

You are so iNFj and what have we talked about not thinking too much about oneself, if not wanting to become crazy ?

[Ilah]

Since when you are iNTj @Ilah ?

You are so iNFj and what have we talked about not thinking too much about oneself, if not wanting to become crazy ?

I think I was born this way. And I tested INTJ on 4 tests I took. I thought I was INTP for a little bit though.

What makes you think I am F, not T? I have never been very good at the emotion stuff, though I do make the effort. And I try to be polite so I don't scare too many people off.

Actually, I only scared one person away from a webgroup (not this one) - that I know of - and she had some major self esteme issues.

Ilah

[entropie]

well you think too much, to test as an F. But from what I have seen from your posts you get fairly deeply into the human soul (your human soul) and some posts were really touching.

Cant give you a definite answer to your questions, but my bet is you are iNFj. That's what fits you well :)

[booya moon]

I used to be pretty unfocused, but I have really improved since I got a more responsible job (by that I mean more people depending on my ability to finish things)

My secret is the little black notebook :D (Moleskin to be more exact). I usually get lots of ideas while working on a project and I have a great urge to investigate these new things, but of course that means not focusing on the original project, ... you get the idea :blush:
So when I get a new idea, instead of pursuing it immediately, I write it down in my notebook for later time - so I can deal with it when I finish the current project(s).

Also you have to find out what your limits are. For example, I found out I can work on (and finish) up to three projects at the same. If I go above this limit, things usually do not turn out too good :cry:

Hope this helps

[Wrath Mania]

The key to finishing projects for me is to have feedback and interaction with others. I wrote a long story back in the day, and the only reason I finished it over one summer was because I had people constantly critiquing and reading it. It was exciting to see how they saw my ideas and plot devices. I could tell you the best way for an ENTP to work is to hone their Introverted Thinking, but that would be a lie and ultimately a fruitless statement. The best way to get stuff done is to make it more than just an exciting concept: make it a dialogue with others who are interested.

[Ilah]

well you think too much, to test as an F. But from what I have seen from your posts you get fairly deeply into the human soul (your human soul) and some posts were really touching.

Cant give you a definite answer to your questions, but my bet is you are iNFj. That's what fits you well :)

Spirituality seems to be based of my N. I am not saying it works that way for other people, but that is how it works for me. Sometimes I can sense a spiritual presence or energy. Often I am drawn to specific spiritual or metaphyscial things. If I had to put this into MBTI terms it seems to fit most into N.

Ilah

[Ilah]

An amendment to my previous post. I just took a cognitive process test on line. My top results were Ni, Ne, Te, Fi in that order. However, the numbers for the tope 4 were very close, Ni was within 3 points of Fi. Te and Fi were almost tied at 41 and 40.8. Assuming the test was correct and that the top 4 scores were close to tied, I could be almost anything that didn't have an S. Well not quite anything, but I see 4 possibilities, ignoring things not allowed by MBTI like NiFi and NeTe.

NiTe = INTJ
TeNi = ENTJ
NeFi = ENFP
FiNe = INFP

Not INFJ though because my Fe was really low.

Ilah

[Samuel De Mazarin]

. . . . If you plan the abstract finish line farther than the concrete one, it's easier to cross the concrete one before you decide the abstract one isn't worth your while any longer.
. . . .

Hmmm... that's not bad at all... feed your ambition all the fantasies it wants (in twenty years I'll get the Nobel Prize), but while you're dangling that carrot in front of your impulsive side, you get down to the details... (that's how my mind interprets what you wrote!!!)

. . . .
The pure, raw "focus" you seek only happens to me when a task or project bears a very, very REAL sense of urgency. Meaning, serious consequences if it's not done. The moment I find out the so-called "urgency" is contrived from someone pushing my buttons my mental focus starts to cloud with static.

YES! I need to keep reminding myself of why something is important... that's something I'll keep in mind... why I am I doing this? I'm amazing (albeit very stressed) when I have deadlines imposed from outside... I have to get this paper done by x time or I'm maxing out with a B in this course... no matter what, I get it done and I'm typically happy with the result...

URGENCY... a good word...

As an ENTP the way to finish what you've started is basically to let thinking come in and slap intuition around whenever it wants to start a new project or just give up.:angry:

. . . .
Stick with it until the end and don't give up.

"Hey wait something really cool just came up, and I want to do that too." No! *smack* Don't do that. Don't give up your goal. Even if you aren't interested in it anymore don't give up. Even when it gets painful don't give up. Let me tell you it will get painful. Don't...give...up!

This is why it's important to focus on only one project at a time. It would be too stressful to try to do this for more than one thing. You've got to focus on that one thing and don't give up.

That is also why thinking is important. Your intuition is impulsive. Thinking will remind you of the reward at the end of the project. It may not feel fun anymore, but thinking can tell you that you'll actually get something by seeing it through til the end. Thinking is ultimately what lets you finish projects.

Yes... this is so in sync with the concrete, with the urgent... and my Fe is loving the fact that you've caught on something really key for me...

IT'S PAINFUL... psychologically painful... when I have to keep doing the same project for a long period of time... it's something I have to suffer...

You'd be a great motivational speaker, LL... you really got me intense about finishing my projects with the way you wrote here... :)

I have found that the best way to do this to forget thinking in terms of a means to an end. In fact forget the end completely. Nothing is ever finished because with each step the information changes and new possibilities present themselves in which one thing can lead to another. However if you stop something before it is finished you gained nothing and the possibilities for growth are limited.

After years of feeling like I kept repeating life with no growth, except maybe a reasonable knowledge, to show for it I began to focus on the levels of actualization. By keeping the bigger picture in mind it has helped me to realize that all the things I must complete now are not indefinite but necessary. Without an immediate end in sight my goals have become larger and my interest necessary for the bigger picture.

I get shit done.

I'm confused... I thought you said to forget the end, but then you say to keep the bigger picture in mind... I'm going to work this in with the prior posts somehow...

On second thought you get to a point where you know how stuff works and you start to focus on where this goes.

I get it... but it's the motivation to stick to it which gets me...

[Samuel De Mazarin]

Today I mainly try to stay focussed by destroying my world. If there is an important thing to be brought to an end, I firstly measure, how good I am at it, in comparing me to others. On this part I was not really good, cause I have always thought of me being just not good enough. Some day that changend and I lost track of the others. Pretty entered some world of my own. Today there are only few times, I get to compare with others and mostly it is by accident or because it is not avoidable. To say the least, I have grown independent from people's opinions. That firstly sounds bad, but it helped me in getting down with my goals.

The second thing I do, when faced with too much input, I go crazy about it. I cut everyone unnecessary off and pull off everyone that wants to get near me, to start lamenting about my lone existence. When then I reach the point, I get bored of lamenting, I start focussing on the things I do under the tragic premisse, what other things are left ?
. . . .

Ah... I empathize... you've hit on something crucial here... the need for approbation... in lucid moments I understand why it is I want to do certain things for themselves, but most of the time I get immersed in the expectation of how the world will see me and my work... and then I get frustrated, because I see everything else the rest of the world has accomplished and is accomplishing even as we speak and I get completely overwhelmed by negativity... and I shut myself in a room... I need to think about why it is that I want to do something... maybe envision myself in a deserted island and understanding what it is that would make me happy under those circumstances... then try to fit it into the real world... which might make me focus less on others and more on my self... because in the end no one can help me realize my projects...

I am INTJ and I have problems with this too.
. . . .
One thing I have done is to tell myself that I can still do everything I want to do. I have a couple little note books and when I see new things that interest me, I write it down and tell myself it is on the list of things to do or study. Even though it may be years before I get to it, telling myself later, rather than no, makes it easier. I don't know if I will get to everything on my list. I started it this month and there is already about 10 to 20 years worth of stuff on it.

I also allow myself small exceptions to the keeping focused. For example, I choose personality types as the 2 year focus for my study. So all the non-fiction books I read in the next 2 years will be on this subject. However, I still read internet articles on various subjects that catch my interest. If it looks intreging I will put it on my list of things to study more in depth.

Ilah

This is a great idea, Ilah! I mean, I write a lot... but I generally get very antsy about listing what it is I like and want to do... in a more Benjamin Franklin sort of way... and I can see how it would be extremely helpful in putting things into perspective... frankly, when it's swimming around in my head, I find it easier to procrastinate on any one thing and to pretend that everything will somehow get done... I get caught up in magical thinking and forget about the practicalities of life and work... since one has to work hard to get things done... which goes back to LL's point about the pain (for people like us) of actually focusing on one thing..


Though I imagine that after one crosses a certain threshold, habit takes over and allows us to get over the pain of monotony and to appreciate the growth that's constantly taking place as a result of our consistently putting in more and more effort into a single task... which becomes something different... the reward comes, I gather, often when one's completely forgotten about it....

I used to be pretty unfocused, but I have really improved since I got a more responsible job (by that I mean more people depending on my ability to finish things)

My secret is the little black notebook :D (Moleskin to be more exact). I usually get lots of ideas while working on a project and I have a great urge to investigate these new things, but of course that means not focusing on the original project, ... you get the idea :blush:
So when I get a new idea, instead of pursuing it immediately, I write it down in my notebook for later time - so I can deal with it when I finish the current project(s).

Also you have to find out what your limits are. For example, I found out I can work on (and finish) up to three projects at the same. If I go above this limit, things usually do not turn out too good :cry:

Hope this helps

Yes.... it does help! Ilah and you have reinforced each other's excellent strategy... something that I've been loathe to do... but I am going to start doing that...

And how very awesome of you... Moleskin notebooks... I had one of those and it was fantastic.... but imagine this... I scrawled tons of stuff on ten pages and now I have no idea where it is!

I'm going to definitely try this... it'll certainly make things more concrete and allow me to better understand my limits, since I'll actually be having to account for my progress on paper as opposed to simply thinking away 'results' by pushing them into the fog of a hundred ideas...

The key to finishing projects for me is to have feedback and interaction with others. I wrote a long story back in the day, and the only reason I finished it over one summer was because I had people constantly critiquing and reading it. It was exciting to see how they saw my ideas and plot devices. I could tell you the best way for an ENTP to work is to hone their Introverted Thinking, but that would be a lie and ultimately a fruitless statement. The best way to get stuff done is to make it more than just an exciting concept: make it a dialogue with others who are interested.

That's good... I actually wanted to get an e-mail list going back in college with friends, where we'd bat around ideas from any discipline, people would give each other feedback... an e-mail creative workshop, but the range was anywhere from ideas for novels and short stories to experimental rock bands and quartets... I got totally derailed by drinking...

[Samuel De Mazarin]

Thank you all! Of course, this thread isn't only for me... it's for everyone... there's a lot of people out there with this problem... and I'm sure I'll be coming back to this thread in a few months with positive feedback on the aids... let's see how I do... college is starting up in a couple of weeks, so there'll be plenty of things for me to juggle and I'll see if I can keep up with schoolwork while still giving into some of my wayward projects... we need diverse stimulation, our kind...

[LucrativeSid]

Here are some random thoughts on the subject:

If you're not interested in something anymore, why do you want to keep going with it? The experience and knowledge knowledge from your last expedition will help on your next. Are you worried that you're just not reaching your potential? What do you think you're missing that you're trying gain?

If you like creating businesses, you might build them, sell them, and move on. It's always fun and challenging this way. Is this perceived as a bad practice? You're actually doing one thing, it just looks very jumbled in the real world.

You could always start a project that never ends, but that always challenges and inspires you. My website is an example of that.

Question your motive for doing something. If you foresee that what you're seeking will be easy to obtain, then perhaps you've got the wrong approach. For example, if you play basketball to impress chicks. Skip the basketball, skip impressing the chicks, and just build your self-esteem, cus that's what you're really after.

I'm pretty scattered myself. The main problem is that I usually quit doing something right before I'm able to get the maximum benefit from it. Like if you roll a rock up a hill 90% and then quit. All it takes is another 10%, then the downhill will be easy. I guess it all depends on what you want out of it.

I've started and quit a few things, including sports, websites, and small businesses. Nothing too special so don't ask me to explain them.

[Edahn]

Hey Samuel,

So yeah. I'm dealing with this issue too, bigtime. I've been studying meditation for a while (and even practicing it, heh) and to be honest, I've had mixed results. I think it would pay in the long run, but I don't even think I'm settled enough to start meditation.

The trick, I think, is in connecting to your body instead of your mind. You can think of your experience as divided along two poles, headspace and bodyspace. ENTPs spend lots and lots of time in headspace. The remedy is to leave it alone and move into the body, and your breath is a good way to do that. You can use your breath to connect with your feelings about this particular moment. Are you anxious? Agitated? Upset? Restless? Check in over and over and see how things are. In fact, you can designate specific times to do this. Idle time is a great opportunity -- driving, walking, sitting, waiting.

[Cality]

How funny! I thought that one of my co-worker, I like a lot (I admire a lot I should say) is ENTP. She is quite different from most other speech path I see who are molsty either ENFJs, ESFJs, ISFJs and a few ENFPs like me. She thinks "global", she sees the globality of the patient and is very creative (N trait associated with P I thought). She is very perceptive on how thier mind works and able to see through them. But She is funny and not that sensitive. She arrives somewhere, makes people laugh. She is very comprehensive (she is a psychologist also beside) but not extremly sensitive.



BUT She is also very very very specialised in 1 or 2 sub-field our job. She prefers doing or 2 types of rehab (basically the hardest one, any physicians in the area send patients to her in priority in 2 major fields) than doing many different sorts of rehab and doing it badly. She is extremly good in what she does. She can talk to physician on a "egal" level because she knows almost as many stuff than physician, she all learned by her self (even medication). She doesn't care about physician's opinion and can stand up against what they say because she sees their flaws in their field. She doesn't care much about their "physicians title" even though she has many physicians friends and has good relationships to them (In this, I am the same way than her, since i study neuropsycholgy and see all the bullshits phyisicans, even neurologist can tell to patients or to us.. ). She is very good relationnally, which made me think she was E. Since she is very very specialised in 1 or 2 field, I am realising she might not be an ENTP according to your thread. She is very very demanding with her interns. She might just be an INTJ who is acting E and P. This could explain this uncredible admiration I have for her (Ni/Ne), like I never had for anyone. Just because I feel our minds works professionally very compatibly. I learn tons with her. She trusts me, I trust her professionnally! She is also buddhist, unconventionnal, open-minded and looks for easy-going but talented co-workers (she owns the office). She is just so different than most speech path I see who are nice, sweet and well organised and extremly pin-pointing everything, over-emotionnal but routinised in their rehab girls and who are unable to tell patients "stop" when they go to far at times. I am so much not fitting into that professionnal environnement. For example, I get better along with physio-therapists for that reason : mostly men, funny, sportly, who can be straight forward with patients at times and able to say "no!" and easy-going!

She had very hard lifes times. She is 50 now. She might have been I before E. This could sound appropriate to her own personal story and personal changes.

[Samuel De Mazarin]

Hey Samuel,

So yeah. I'm dealing with this issue too, bigtime. I've been studying meditation for a while (and even practicing it, heh) and to be honest, I've had mixed results. I think it would pay in the long run, but I don't even think I'm settled enough to start meditation.

The trick, I think, is in connecting to your body instead of your mind. You can think of your experience as divided along two poles, headspace and bodyspace. ENTPs spend lots and lots of time in headspace. The remedy is to leave it alone and move into the body, and your breath is a good way to do that. You can use your breath to connect with your feelings about this particular moment. Are you anxious? Agitated? Upset? Restless? Check in over and over and see how things are. In fact, you can designate specific times to do this. Idle time is a great opportunity -- driving, walking, sitting, waiting.

I like that... getting to know the body... this is all covered quite comprehensively in traditional Hindu philosophy... Patanjali recommends four practices to ensure that meditation actually occurs...

1) Moral restraints - self-discipline in everyday life

2) Ethical restraints - consideration and fair dealing with others and the world around one

3) Asanas - physical postures and exercises to loosen and tone up the body...

4) Praanayama - breathing exercises which ostensibly also increase oxygen intake, open up inner channels... etc...

_________________________________

Perhaps finding time away from this, by walking/running in the park or something, I could buttress these techniques with stuff that's absolutely and utterly unplanned, not focused on a goal... just me-time...

yeah... that's good, Edahn.. I stopped taking time to just 'do nothing' a while ago, and my headspace has become congested... I need to air it...

[Edahn]

I like that... getting to know the body... this is all covered quite comprehensively in traditional Hindu philosophy... Patanjali recommends four practices to ensure that meditation actually occurs...

1) Moral restraints - self-discipline in everyday life

2) Ethical restraints - consideration and fair dealing with others and the world around one

3) Asanas - physical postures and exercises to loosen and tone up the body...

4) Praanayama - breathing exercises which ostensibly also increase oxygen intake, open up inner channels... etc...

_________________________________

Perhaps finding time away from this, by walking/running in the park or something, I could buttress these techniques with stuff that's absolutely and utterly unplanned, not focused on a goal... just me-time...

yeah... that's good, Edahn.. I stopped taking time to just 'do nothing' a while ago, and my headspace has become congested... I need to air it...

The danger for me, and I can already see that the danger for you too, is intellectualizing the whole thing and turning it into a game... making connections with this philosophy and that philosophy, and why this makes sense, and how this comports with that... I'm not saying you shouldn't do it, but you shouldn't do it while you're connecting with your body. And you'll want to, because it's fucking fascinating. Still though, keep an eye out for that trap.

[Hmm]

Samuel,

I must ask... why do you feel that you need to develop one-pointedness?

[BlueWing]

Study formal logic. Mathematics if you can even. Take time out of the day (1 or 2 hours) to do nothing. Just sit and think. The former should clearly engage your Ti and latter Ti in connection with Si. Once you get comfortable with the Ti-Si axis, it should be much easier for you to develop a focus. Ti gives a clear direction to your perceptions and Si carves out a single, concrete path of perception rather than many abstract perceptions as commonly produced by Ne.

(When you study formal logic, make an effort to learn the conventional symbolism, this will train your Si as well. For the sake of pure Ti, read literature on logic and philosophy of mathematics. Expose yourself to philosophy the best you can, but logic is the best way to train your Ti, symbolic logic to train your Ti-Si)

[entropie]

I recently indirectly was made aware that it is in fact the T-S connection that when searching for a more logical proweness is important. Comes completly new too me and I need to dig into this, but your advise surely is good and understandable :).

Still one thing that bugs me:

Take time out of the day (1 or 2 hours) to do nothing

xDD I guess this is just impossible xD

[animenagai]

this is probably not a mainly ENTP thing. for starters, this is precisely my biggest problem. i think any NP will have this problem. we like new things and creativity but we are also spontaneous and don't like things so structured. it's only natural for us to not finish projects if we find there we are particularly stale or have new interests. this is definitely a problem, as it would be nice to see some finished products. however, i don't think we have these projects always with a goal in mind. i think we like to be mentally stimulated, creatively stimulated etc. and that is the point in itself. therefore, when we don't find a project exciting anymore, the 'point' is no longer there, so we move on.

[BlueWing]

this is probably not a mainly ENTP thing. for starters, this is precisely my biggest problem. i think any NP will have this problem. we like new things and creativity but we are also spontaneous and don't like things so structured. it's only natural for us to not finish projects if we find there we are particularly stale or have new interests. this is definitely a problem, as it would be nice to see some finished products. however, i don't think we have these projects always with a goal in mind. i think we like to be mentally stimulated, creatively stimulated etc. and that is the point in itself. therefore, when we don't find a project exciting anymore, the 'point' is no longer there, so we move on.

Ti likes an internal structure of thought. This is the function that an ENTP needs to develop to become more put together. Developing Te has a similar effect on the NFP.

[Lithium]

I have found that the best way to do this to forget thinking in terms of a means to an end. In fact forget the end completely. Nothing is ever finished because with each step the information changes and new possibilities present themselves in which one thing can lead to another. However if you stop something before it is finished you gained nothing and the possibilities for growth are limited.

After years of feeling like I kept repeating life with no growth, except maybe a reasonable knowledge, to show for it I began to focus on the levels of actualization. By keeping the bigger picture in mind it has helped me to realize that all the things I must complete now are not indefinite but necessary. Without an immediate end in sight my goals have become larger and my interest necessary for the bigger picture.

I get shit done.

I do this, without realizing it. I used to be enthuse about knew things and then lose interest, in some ways I still do. What changed is having the bigger picture in mind. Then all the little things start not to matter. I still don't complete things, but they aren't important. If I've already gotten out of it as much as I want then why carry on? Like some people have mentioned. As long as I'm adding to the bigger picture and completing stuff that will help that a long. Then you're free to do what ever you want. The knock on affect as things in the big picture get done, other things start to as well.

IN short, it's all about having a direction and worrying about never finishing things likely stems from not knowing what it is you want to get out of it.

[Mozzes]

I think first you must have at least a foggy notion of where in life you want to go and then you take the first step. And then another. And then another while remembering that it's always possible to change direction is one is so inclined. But what happens when you try to move in every direction at once? You spin in circles. You go nowhere.

[Ilah]

While I have had a fairly stable worklife, my hobbies have been all over the place. In the past I have occasionally gotten a little flack about it. Some people said I quit things too easily. The idea was also brought up that if I had actually stayed with something, instead of getting a new hobbie every year or two, I would be very good at it now.

Generally, I reacted fairly negatively to these type of comments. I felt that since this was just something I did for enjoyment, as long as I enjoyed it, why did it matter if I stayed with it or not.

It has only been in recent years where I felt a desire to become more focused. It had to come from inside. I think people telling me what I should do often makes me what to not do it.

The thing is being very talent/knowledgable in an area has a lot of appeal to me. It is just that I want to an expert in so many different things, and that is not realistic. Maybe expert is not the right word. I am not sure what word to use. If I worked on my drawing for 10 years (as a hobbie) I wouldn't call that an expert level, but it would be much better that someone who worked on it for 2 years then quit.

For me it is about the satisfaction of learning a new skill (or new knowledge) v. the satisfaction of growing in that skill and knoweledge. For some reason growing in the skill or knowledge is more satifsying for me know.

I don't think getting board is only one cause of it. Another cause is getting easily distracted by other things that look interesting. Often times learning how to do the basics is much easier than moving from a beginner level to an intermediate of advanced level. It can be frustrating, and sometimes you wonder if the hard work and effort is worth it. But if you choose not to go to the next level, it can be a little discouraging to still be at begginer level after 2 years.

So for me it is mainly about not being distracted and putting in the extra effort for improvement.

Ilah


Here are some random thoughts on the subject:

If you're not interested in something anymore, why do you want to keep going with it? The experience and knowledge knowledge from your last expedition will help on your next. Are you worried that you're just not reaching your potential? What do you think you're missing that you're trying gain?

If you like creating businesses, you might build them, sell them, and move on. It's always fun and challenging this way. Is this perceived as a bad practice? You're actually doing one thing, it just looks very jumbled in the real world.

You could always start a project that never ends, but that always challenges and inspires you. My website is an example of that.

Question your motive for doing something. If you foresee that what you're seeking will be easy to obtain, then perhaps you've got the wrong approach. For example, if you play basketball to impress chicks. Skip the basketball, skip impressing the chicks, and just build your self-esteem, cus that's what you're really after.

I'm pretty scattered myself. The main problem is that I usually quit doing something right before I'm able to get the maximum benefit from it. Like if you roll a rock up a hill 90% and then quit. All it takes is another 10%, then the downhill will be easy. I guess it all depends on what you want out of it.

I've started and quit a few things, including sports, websites, and small businesses. Nothing too special so don't ask me to explain them.

[Synarch]

The key to finishing projects for me is to have feedback and interaction with others. I wrote a long story back in the day, and the only reason I finished it over one summer was because I had people constantly critiquing and reading it. It was exciting to see how they saw my ideas and plot devices. I could tell you the best way for an ENTP to work is to hone their Introverted Thinking, but that would be a lie and ultimately a fruitless statement. The best way to get stuff done is to make it more than just an exciting concept: make it a dialogue with others who are interested.

Great idea, checking in with others. I also like the notebook idea above. Problem is sticking to this.