How strongly do you identify with the SJ/Guardian temperament?

[sassafrassquatch]

Since there seems to be an influx of ISTJs recently maybe I can get a large sampling here.

I feel very little connection with the descriptions of the SJ/Guardian temperament or the ISTJ personality. While it is difficult for me to read them without imagining conservative republicans it still doesn’t click with me. I despise most of the things which define the SJ temperament like tradition, duty, joining groups and group loyalty, doing things by-the-book rather than finding the best way, respecting authority and titles, I hate being burdened with responsibility.

I started a thread several months ago about SJs being socially/politically liberal but this is much broader.

According to this function inventory I am ISTJ. Although if I'm reading it correctly Te would appear to be my dominant function making me an ESTJ. :shock:

(Se) ******************* (19.7)
limited use
(Si) ************************************************** **** (54.1)
excellent use
(Ne) *************** (15.1)
unused
(Ni) *********** (11.3)
unused
(Te) ************************************************** ***** (55.1)
excellent use
(Ti) *********************************************** (47.5)
excellent use
(Fe) ******* (7.3)
unused
(Fi) ***************************** (29.3)
average use
Understanding the Eight Jungian Cognitive Processes / Eight Functions Attitudes (http://www.cognitiveprocesses.com/assessment/survey.html)

I’m curious to see how many SJs here are atypical.

[CaptainChick]

LOL, sorry, felt like taking a test!!

:D

extraverted Sensing (Se) ******************************** (32.3)
good use
introverted Sensing (Si) ********** (10.5)
unused
extraverted Intuiting (Ne) ************************************ (36.6)
excellent use
introverted Intuiting (Ni) ******************************** (32.4)
good use
extraverted Thinking (Te) ************* (13.7)
unused
introverted Thinking (Ti) ***************************** (29.3)
average use
extraverted Feeling (Fe) ************************************** (38.2)
excellent use
introverted Feeling (Fi) *********************************************** (47.6)
excellent use

Summary Analysis of Profile
By focusing on the strongest configuration of cognitive processes, your pattern of responses most closely matches individuals of this type: ENFP

Lead (Dominant) Process
Extraverted Intuiting (Ne): Exploring the emerging patterns. Wondering about patterns of interaction across various situations. Checking what hypotheses and meanings fit best. Trusting what emerges as you shift a situation’s dynamics.

Support (Auxilliary) Process
Introverted Feeling (Fi): Staying true to who you really are. Paying close attention to your personal identity, values and beliefs. Checking with your conscience. Choosing behavior congruent with what is important to you.

[CaptainChick]

Note, I didn't really like that test at all, I felt like 25% of the questions were odd, or unclear, or both.

[sassafrassquatch]

Yeah, a lot of the questions had a WTFness to them. It really doesn't help that most MBTI material is written in this unintelligible abstract language.

[dnivera]

I trust online personality tests very little these days. I feel like I already know too much about what my type is already, so my answers might be "skewed."

I got Si>Ti>Te>Ne. Not 'in the box' at all.

Cognitive Process Level of Development (Preference, Skill and Frequency of Use)
extraverted Sensing (Se) ******************* (19.9)
limited use
introverted Sensing (Si) ***************************************** (41.3)
excellent use
extraverted Intuiting (Ne) ****************************** (30.3)
good use
introverted Intuiting (Ni) *************************** (27.2)
average use
extraverted Thinking (Te) ********************************* (33.2)
good use
introverted Thinking (Ti) ********************************** (34.2)
good use
extraverted Feeling (Fe) *************************** (27.3)
average use
introverted Feeling (Fi) *************************** (27)
average use

[Uberfuhrer]

It kind of helps if you don't look at the questions in such a stereotypical way.

Like, for example, Ni is often described as the type of the prophets, which is a very generalized description of this type. But it could also relate to more down-to-earth premonitions, such as having a vision you are then compelled to make something happen. A vision not necessarily of what is to happen, but a vision for any sort of change.

Envisioning something extravagant like the end of the world is the same exact idea as envisioning yourself as a certain way or in a situation that you currently are not in.

[sassafrassquatch]

It kind of helps if you don't look at the questions in such a stereotypical way.

Like, for example, Ni is often described as the type of the prophets, which is a very generalized description of this type. But it could also relate to more down-to-earth premonitions, such as having a vision you are then compelled to make something happen. A vision not necessarily of what is to happen, but a vision for any sort of change.

Envisioning something extravagant like the end of the world is the same exact idea as envisioning yourself as a certain way or in a situation that you currently are not in.

Maybe I should just call myself INTJ having eliminated all other types even though I don't understand Ni as throughly as I'd like to.

[squibbles]

For what it's worth, I feel the same way. I usually score S/N 50/50, or max 55% one way or the other. But, because I identify with the INTJ profile more than the ISTJ profile on the whole, I self-typed as that one.

I'm not as out-of-the-box as the archetypal INTJ, but I'm not as traditional as the archetypal ISTJ.

This test in particular has typed me as everything from an ISTJ to an INFP. The only thing it knows is that I'm introverted!

[pure_mercury]

Since there seems to be an influx of ISTJs recently maybe I can get a large sampling here.

I feel very little connection with the descriptions of the SJ/Guardian temperament or the ISTJ personality. While it is difficult for me to read them without imagining conservative republicans it still doesn’t click with me. I despise most of the things which define the SJ temperament like tradition, duty, joining groups and group loyalty, doing things by-the-book rather than finding the best way, respecting authority and titles, I hate being burdened with responsibility.

I am an ESFJ and a libertarian. I do like having people depend on me, I am somewhat of a joiner (a lot of friends, sports fan, I love parties and get-togethers), and I will take on responsibilities I feel I can handle. I can be quite a "by-the-book" type, as well. However, I am very cynical about "the book" itself. I am skeptical of most authority, though I will respect it if I feel it has been earned. I disagree with some of your assessment about the SJ mentality: you seem to oversimplify SJs as blind followers, which is not the case, and there are many authority-loving, "by-the-book" political liberals running around in this world, as well. Best thing to remember: you are an individual, and you are not defined by your functions.

[Haphazard]

I am an ESFJ and a libertarian. I do like having people depend on me, I am somewhat of a joiner (a lot of friends, sports fan, I love parties and get-togethers, and I will take on responsibilities I feel I can handle. I can be quite a "by-the-book" type, as well. However, I am very cynical about "the book" itself. I am skeptical of most authority, though I will respect it if I feel it has been earned. I disagree with some of your assessment about the SJ mentality: you seem to oversimplify SJs as blind followers, which is not the case, and there are many authority-loving, "by-the-book" political liberals running around in this world, as well. Best thing to remember: you are an individual, and you are not defined by your functions.

:wubbie:

[pure_mercury]

:wubbie:

Right back at you, love.

[Homini Lupus]

Consider the fact that the personality type is different from what you perceive of yourself, your ideals and what you want to be. For most of my youth I would have passed for ISTJ, but that's more because of the image I made of myself rather than a switch in the use of cognitive processes.

Consider also that those online tests at time don't really get to the point.

[Uberfuhrer]

The problem with most of the SJ descriptions is that they are far too folksy. The image implanted in my head when reading the about the Guardians seems distinctly similar to the community of a conservative small town.

But I think that with any of the temperaments, the SJ is hardest to pin down, particularly in a diverse region.

The core motivation of the SJ type is belonging to any sort of organization and upholding values of any organization, even an intellectual organization stereotypically associated with NT. So if an SJ is a supporter of the scientific method, then he will likely uphold those scientific values and laws and would likely become suspicious when those values are challenged without any hardcore facts.

Temperament is not really about how a person fits in with world as much as it is how they approach their world. How a person of a temperament fits in with the world is mostly a side effect of their natural approach to it.

[sassafrassquatch]

The core motivation of the SJ type is belonging to any sort of organization and upholding values of any organization

That's the part that I don't identify with. I don't want to belong to any group or support their values. The only thing I'm a guardian of is my own mind. I have always felt that to subvert the self in favor of the group is a kind of intellectual suicide.

[Magic Poriferan]

I think Keirsey bares a lot of responsibility for some of the most common ways people misuse and misunderstand the MBTI and the cognitive processes.

[Haphazard]

I think Keirsey bares a lot of responsibility for some of the most common ways people misuse and misunderstand the MBTI and the cognitive processes.

Is it just me, or did it really sound like there was an undertone of resentment in the Keirsey SJ profiles?

[chris1207]

extraverted Sensing (Se) ************************ (24.3)
average use
introverted Sensing (Si) ********************** (22.3)
limited use
extraverted Intuiting (Ne) *********************** (23.3)
limited use
introverted Intuiting (Ni) ************************************* (37.2)
excellent use
extraverted Thinking (Te) ********************* (21.9)
limited use
introverted Thinking (Ti) *************************** (27.2)
average use
extraverted Feeling (Fe) ************************************************** (50.6)
excellent use
introverted Feeling (Fi) ********************************* (33.4)
good use

There's my scores. I hate the fact that they say the test is a work in progress that we have to help make better and then they tell us that the point of the test was that we ultimately were going to understand some of the questions. Eh... I left the comments box blank....

I gotta say that Te/Ti are higher than expected. It's prolly cuz I'm a guy though.

Does anyone else ever freak out and go "oh man! I really hope I get my same type, cuz if no I don't have any idea who or what the fuck I am!"? I'm like that! :)

[pure_mercury]

I have always felt that to subvert the self in favor of the group is a kind of intellectual suicide.

Who said you had to "subvert the self?" Your interpretation of SJ characteristics seems so negative.

[oasispaw]

Cognitive Process Level of Development (Preference, Skill and Frequency of Use)
extraverted Sensing (Se) ******************************** (32)
good use
introverted Sensing (Si) ********************************* (33.1)
good use
extraverted Intuiting (Ne) ***************************** (29.9)
average use
introverted Intuiting (Ni) ***************** (17)
limited use
extraverted Thinking (Te) *********************************** (35.1)
good use
introverted Thinking (Ti) ****************************** (30)
average use
extraverted Feeling (Fe) ****************************** (30)
average use
introverted Feeling (Fi) ******************************** (32.9)
good use

Summary Analysis of Profile
By focusing on the strongest configuration of cognitive processes, your pattern of responses most closely matches individuals of this type: ESTJ

Lead (Dominant) Process
Extraverted Thinking (Te): Measuring and constructing for progress. Making decisions objectively based on evidence and measures. Checking if things function properly. Applying a procedure to control events and complete goals.

Support (Auxilliary) Process
Introverted Sensing (Si): Stabilizing with a predictable standard. Carefully comparing a situation to the customary ways you’ve come to rely on. Checking with past experiences. Stabilizing a situation and invest for future security.

If these cognitive processes don't fit well then consider these types: ISTJ, or ESFP



PS- sassafrassquatch, love your name and avatar. is that from tenacious d's drunken rendition of "spiderman"?

[Magic Poriferan]

Is it just me, or did it really sound like there was an undertone of resentment in the Keirsey SJ profiles?

I don't recall enough to say if there was resentment. I do remember that it sounded ignorant, and excissively simple and narrow.